Some originally paper based scores or scales use mixed data types or explicit choices which evaluate to a NULL value. One example is the NANO scale , which uses this pattern for all its elements: [image] The first four values here would fit right into a DV_ORDINAL, but the final two do not. We’ve …

Conclusion for now, from the modellers perspective: The published GOSE archetype uses the ordinal ‘99’ to indicate an unscored value, similar to NANO’s “not assessed” and “not evaluable”. This is similar to option #2, but makes it possible for business logic to tell the actual values apart from th…

[image] ian.mcnicoll: We have probably had a lucky escape with this particular archetype since it does not compute a total score and therefore a 0 ordinal is probably safe Are you sure? I don’t understand how using 0 doesn’t make it difficult to distinguish “Not assessed” from “Normal”. Diff…

ok ‘lucky-ish’ escape - it would have been much more problematic if there had been a computed score - at least the text e.g. ‘not assessesed’ will be visible when assessing the response.

[image] siljelb: I agree with Sebastian though, that the null_flavours should be defined more thoroughly in the specs. Currently it’s often difficult to tell ‘not applicable’ from ‘no information’, and the possibility of applying a ‘masked’ flavour as a query result makes my head spin. I’m not s…

[image] sebastian.garde: No more flavours than necessary, I agree…some from FHIR seem to be specialisations of the more generic ones that we already share between FHIR and openEHR. We looked at the flavours in a discussion the other day and it suddenly appeared to me: Do we really need to dis…

[image] ian.mcnicoll: at least the text e.g. ‘not assessesed’ will be visible when assessing the response. Agree. I don’t know how this particular score is used, whether it’s only once and never again, or it’s repeated to give an idea of progression. If the latter, it’s not unreasonable to gr…

[image] bna: The question is: Are there any known use of the NULL_FLAVOUR today? If yes - what’s your experiences using the different flavours? Is the current list of flavours good enough? Do you miss any flavours Null flavours is a tough topic that has been discussed for a long time. @thoma…

[image] ian.mcnicoll: null_flavours and associated reason codes to ‘appear’ to be added to a Valueset These are formally two different vocabularies - the null_flavours is sourced from openEHR terminology, while reason text/codes are on a per archetype basis. I’d suggest that we don’t want pe…

[image] thomas.beale: ‘masked’ originally was designed to be a NF that is set by a server when it hides (i.e. removes) some data item because it is ‘sensitive’, when it provides the data to some client system or application. Whether this still makes sense is an open question, since I don’t think…

[image] thomas.beale: I’d suggest that we don’t want people being able to edit the null_flavours vocabulary in an uncontrolled way (this will wreck any computability). I can imagine however that AD and similar tools would make it easy to see the vocabulary and potentially post a change request. …

Scores or scales with mixed data types or explicit NULL values

Clinical

siljelb (Silje Ljosland Bakke) 15 November 2023 04:58 20

That’s not exactly what I meant. My thinking was that a null value could be returned on a query where the person or organisation running the query for some reason didn’t have access to the data. The null_flavour would be returned alongside the null value to explain the reason why there’s no data.

But yeah, I’d love for this kind of thing to be further clarified.

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Scores or scales with mixed data types or explicit NULL values

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